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  #81  
Old 05-17-2012, 02:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Mind of Oz View Post
There is no "safe place" except in God,not Gold,but God.
Seems things get carried away,we still want our "little golden calfs to dance around"
And He (God)stated that 'in that day" (the end as we know it) they will throw their gold in the streets,it will be worthless.
You cannot serve both God and Mammon...

You are seeing it. Good.

Our Debt Currency system is evil. Being in debt is enslavement...regardless if it is your debt or a measure of someone elses...THAT WHICH IS WHAT CONSTITUTES OUR CURRENCY.

Gold...on the other hand...is not a debt based money.

I DO NOT SERVE GOLD. GOLD SERVES ME. I am master and have the dominion over it.

This LIBERATES me so that I may serve my Master Jesus Christ.

Free at last I am free at last. Thank God Almighty that I am free at last.

Tall Tom
I Cor 13
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Last edited by tall tom : 05-17-2012 at 02:58 PM.
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  #82  
Old 05-17-2012, 04:01 PM
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Well, at least today, looks like many still do see gold as a "safe haven" -- stocks fall, while gold goes up. Nothing is for sure "safe", and that is a good thing in a free society -- but does look like gold still stands as a "safe haven" by standard definition going by events of today. I like the yellow, not my banking fellows.
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  #83  
Old 05-17-2012, 04:46 PM
DonerKebab DonerKebab is offline
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Originally Posted by motocat View Post
Well, at least today, looks like many still do see gold as a "safe haven" -- stocks fall, while gold goes up. Nothing is for sure "safe", and that is a good thing in a free society -- but does look like gold still stands as a "safe haven" by standard definition going by events of today. I like the yellow, not my banking fellows.
What you saw today was not "safe haven buying". Gold has not traded as a safe haven since 9 months ago. It's been correlated with risk assets and other commodities in the industrial commodities complex. Instead, what you saw today was buying resulting from poor economic data which many traders interpreted as a leading indicator that the Federal Reserve will engage in another round of quantitative easing which is very different from safe haven buying that you saw when many believed that there was a possibility that the US might default last year.

Until gold delinks from the EURUSD over a sustained period we can't say it's trading as a safe haven asset.

Last edited by DonerKebab : 05-17-2012 at 04:50 PM.
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  #84  
Old 05-17-2012, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonerKebab View Post
What you saw today was not "safe haven buying". Gold has not traded as a safe haven since 9 months ago. It's been correlated with risk assets and other commodities in the industrial commodities complex. Instead, what you saw today was buying resulting from poor economic data which many traders interpreted as a leading indicator that the Federal Reserve will engage in another round of quantitative easing which is very different from safe haven buying that you saw when many believed that there was a possibility that the US might default last year.

Until gold delinks from the EURUSD over a sustained period we can't say it's trading as a safe haven asset.
It's a matter of ones definition of "safe haven", and also understanding and knowledge of others actions and who is now buying, none of which you are the final arbitrator of.
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  #85  
Old 05-18-2012, 12:22 AM
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Default just what are you writing about?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonerKebab View Post
What you saw today was not "safe haven buying". Gold has not traded as a safe haven since 9 months ago. It's been correlated with risk assets and other commodities in the industrial commodities complex. Instead, what you saw today was buying resulting from poor economic data which many traders interpreted as a leading indicator that the Federal Reserve will engage in another round of quantitative easing which is very different from safe haven buying that you saw when many believed that there was a possibility that the US might default last year.

Until gold delinks from the EURUSD over a sustained period we can't say it's trading as a safe haven asset.
Is this another MSM parroting?

SOME PEOPLE believe that investing their currency into an asset which will maintain its VALUE...while the initiation of the next QE which DEVALUES THE CURRENCY... consider this to be a SAFE HAVEN of maintaining their WEALTH.

To them Gold becomes a Safe Haven at this point. It is safe because it will not lose VALUE while the currency loses VALUE.

Did you even consider this in your thoughts? Did you even think about the points which you wrote about? Or are you just parroting some MSM Government paid hack?

Tall Tom
I Cor 13
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Last edited by tall tom : 05-18-2012 at 12:28 AM.
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  #86  
Old 05-18-2012, 12:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonerKebab View Post
... Gold has not traded as a safe haven since 9 months ago. It's been correlated with risk assets and other commodities in the industrial commodities complex. ...
Excellent summation. The key word here being 'traded'. Gold and to a similar extent silver, retain their value as precious metal for reasons too numerous to list here shortly, yet their place in the trading matrix is evidently becoming more prominent of late?


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Last edited by OvalNut : 05-18-2012 at 12:38 AM.
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  #87  
Old 05-18-2012, 01:52 AM
Pragmatic Joe Pragmatic Joe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonerKebab View Post
Instead, what you saw today was buying resulting from poor economic data which many traders interpreted as a leading indicator that the Federal Reserve will engage in another round of quantitative easing
hedging against QE is still safe haven buying no matter how you spin it
I didn't see the Diamond IDEX spike last night
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  #88  
Old 05-18-2012, 02:04 AM
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tall tom tall tom is offline
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Originally Posted by Pragmatic Joe View Post
hedging against QE is still safe haven buying no matter how you spin it
I didn't see the Diamond IDEX spike last night
More elegantly stated than what I wrote. Thanks.

Tall Tom
I Cor 13
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  #89  
Old 05-18-2012, 03:53 AM
DonerKebab DonerKebab is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tall tom View Post
Is this another MSM parroting?

SOME PEOPLE believe that investing their currency into an asset which will maintain its VALUE...while the initiation of the next QE which DEVALUES THE CURRENCY... consider this to be a SAFE HAVEN of maintaining their WEALTH.

To them Gold becomes a Safe Haven at this point. It is safe because it will not lose VALUE while the currency loses VALUE.

Did you even consider this in your thoughts? Did you even think about the points which you wrote about? Or are you just parroting some MSM Government paid hack?

Tall Tom
I Cor 13
I don't think you understand the markets. Do you even understand the mechanics of how gold shoots up 2.4% in a day? This is COMEX trading of futures contracts, this isn't your retail investor running to preserve wealth and buying physical gold. This is hedge funds and other large financial institutions making a directional bet on gold based on a belief that the Federal Reserve will engage in quantitative easing as a result of poor economic data. This is also technical buying as a result of gold breaching oversold levels on the RSI. These are the same traders that will put a short position on gold as soon as they know QE will come to an end. They are also the same traders that will book profits when gold gets to oversold levels i.e., exchanging their paper gold for paper money. If you think these institutions pay returns to their investors in the form of gold I have a bridge to sell you; they pay their investors with fiat money.

A true safe haven would not behave as it does when there is stress in the Eurozone. Right now, Treasuries and German Bunds are THE safe havens. Once the focus shifts to the U.S. or Germany (in the event of a euro break up), then gold will act as a safe haven as it did last August and Treasuries will tumble.

It's pretty simple, it's not rocket science. I suggest you be far less emotional about an asset class. I call a spade a spade. You can do well with gold declining or rising. I short paper gold through the options market when I feel it's appropriate and I also take bets to the upside when called for. And I also hold substantial amounts of physical gold for the record.

Last edited by DonerKebab : 05-18-2012 at 03:56 AM.
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  #90  
Old 05-18-2012, 04:17 AM
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I don't think the spike up was safe haven buying (or even safe heaven- har har). It was probably as they expected, a short cover trigger. Although if it stays long enough here or if there a couple of more triggers or an elliot wave continuation, then combined with the euro situation, enough investors may interpret it as 'safe haven' and jump on the band wagon. A sure catalyst for this is another JPM or related thing.
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